by the way: my pastor is encouraging me to consider finishing my MDiv in the ELCA–which i should be able to do with advance standing because of my MATS from bethel. it will be interesting to see what happens in the next few months in the ELCA due to the recent sexuality study and upcoming vote.

But I really do not see the tone of surprise in this one. If anything, it always surprises me when Protestants come to catholic conclusions. Prejudicial, I know. But it comes from my own background.

Congratulations on joining a Lutheran parish. I pray for you and your family regularly.

I do not disagree with you that there are immense differences between modern Protestantism and its founders. I think you are quite right on this point. My Church History professor at seminary often argued that Lutherans and Wesleyans (though this would certainly apply to most reformers) are generally doing a disservice to the founders of their respective denominations, since their founders never intended to create or further sects, but rather to make a positive contribution to the Church as it already was. Luther would have been content to be a Catholic monk indefinitely, and would have envisioned the people who became “Lutherans” as remaining Catholic (albeit without indulgences). Wesley never renounced his membership in the Anglican Church (thus raising the issue that Wesley was not necessarily a reformer in the same vein as Luther, but that is most certainly another topic for another time). It might also be helpful to point out that there are immense differences between American Protestantism and European (or African, or Asian) Protestantism. As for the question of degree of veneration for Mary: While American Protestantism may go overboard in non-veneration, I think the case could easily be made that Latin American Catholicism goes too far in the other direction. A North American example: While official church theology does not posit any miracle in the “

,” I think a case could be made that church doctrine contributes to an environment wherein such would be (pardon the awful pun) gobbled up by laypersons.

I am dedicated to Protestantism, but more significantly, I am dedicated to fostering interfaith dialogue that is mutually beneficial to everyone involved. I realize that you and I aren’t going to agree on every issue of faith–I’ve never assumed that we would–but is it possible for us to talk about these issues in a spirit of humility, cooperation and kindness? Can we learn from each other, or do we both start from the perspective that we have nothing to learn from the “other”? I know that I can be extremely argumentative from time to time, and for that, I ask for your forgiveness. I do not believe I have discovered all the “answers” to the questions that a person of faith struggles with–one issue I have come to appreciate in your tradition is the embracing of mystery, rather than the attempt to explain and rationalize it all away–and I hope you don’t think that I am quite as dogmatic as I may come across. For my part, I am as much on a journey as I ever was–my wife and I (and our 2 month old son, Eliot Coltrane Sherry) are taking the first steps to joining a Lutheran church (ELCA), and whether my journey only takes me as far as Wittenberg or farther, I cannot say. Know this, though–I sincerely do appreciate reading your thoughts on theological issues, disparate though they may be from my own at times, and I still think that you ought to head yourself toward seminary once your military commitments are completed, if for no other reason than to study under people who can further guide you.

Your perspective is one that is dedicated to Protestantism, and I’m trying to respect that. Personally, I think the Protestant project is proving itself everyday to be a dismal failure, but on many subjects I could point to early Reformers as support for my points. The subject of Mary particularly reveals a deep rift between contemporary Protestantism and its founders.

This perspective is not myopic; it is catholic. It is precisely because of its abandonment of catholicity that Protestantism is becoming an increasingly divided federation of theological myopias that would not be recognized by Luther, Calvin, Wesley, or Wycliffe.

second: given that much of the basis of protestantism is at core its non-catholicness, disclaimers shouldn’t be surprising to you, either.

third: you perhaps also refer to the protestant desire to not practice “mariolatry” as a form of idolatry. face it: you’re not going to see eye to eye with many protestants on this issue, because many, perhaps most, protestants see veneration of any sort as idolatry.

what always strikes me in your postings that refer back to protestantism is what seems like myopia on your part. of course you’ve gone through a big paradigm shift through your journey to Orthodoxy, but why do you always seem so “surprised” that protestants still “don’t get it”? your post about Sixpence’s “There She Goes” cover struck me this way as well. perhaps this would come off better if rather than sharing your “surprise” when Christians who are clearly not in the same theological camp as yourself “don’t get it” you kept in mind that you (probably) weren’t always where you are today.

My response to this and a host of other issues was to seek a more catholic community altogether, but I find it interesting that a few Protestants — like the Rev. Kimel — see the same problem.